Heritage of Healing

The Ancient Wisdom of Healing Trauma

• Michelle Rios Rice and Liz Howard • Season 1 • Episode 12

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Discover the transformative power of ancient wisdom in healing trauma according to the ancient traditions of curanderismo. With striking statistics from the World Health Organization highlighting the prevalence of trauma and PTSD, we explore the necessity of a dual consciousness to help individuals navigate their immediate challenges while maintaining their identity and strengths beyond trauma. Michelle shares her unique expertise in retraining the mind and energy frequencies, providing hope and transformation for those seeking alternative paths to healing.

We'll also uncover the sacred art of active listening as a catalyst for healing, drawing inspiration from ancient traditions such as the talking circles of indigenous cultures. By genuinely listening from the heart and suspending our judgments, we can foster empathic connections that lead to profound understanding and transformation. We discuss the energetic exchange involved in listening to others' pain and offer practical strategies for healers and empathic individuals to replenish their own energy, utilizing the cleansing powers of water, air, and fire. This episode champions the healing potential of love, empathy, and presence, encouraging a listening approach that embraces compassion and creates a space for healing.

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Speaker 1:

Trauma will impact most of the world's population at some point. Covid was an example of how global events can take a toll. For years, there are ways to heal from trauma and even PTSD that have been clinically studied, but did the ancients have a deep understanding of healing trauma as well? Have a deep understanding of healing trauma as well? After all, they experienced famine, war, extreme cultural oppression and violation, and yet they carried on. Listen as Michelle starts the conversation about the ancient ways, the energetic ways, the magical ways of healing trauma and PTSD. What is trauma?

Speaker 1:

Usually, the definition sounds something like an emotional response to a distressing event which often endures over time. Some definitions will include that the negative impacts of trauma can impact the mental, physical, social, emotional and spiritual well-being of a person. Here's what's overwhelming Most people will endure some potential trauma. The World Health Organization says that about 70% of the global population will experience a potentially traumatic event within their lifetime. They estimate that only a minority of about 5.6%, you know, of the entire world will develop PTSD. That's not a small number, though, and what worries me, as a subject matter expert in organizational culture issues, is that we know for sure that women are more affected by PTSD than men Really go back to the WHO and other reputable sources to check the research if you're dubious. But since women's issues are often less studied, less funded and less believed, a well-educated statistician very well might question if the data is truly reflective of reality. And that same data might be questioned for any marginalized group that doesn't have the same voice in clinical settings. So we acknowledge that trauma is not to be taken lightly and we acknowledge that there could be underreporting of trauma and PTSD. In fact, those that might not be reporting to these large surveys very well might be the ones seeking out curanderismo.

Speaker 1:

But before we go any further, as you've heard me say so many times before, this podcast does not offer any medical advice. This podcast is just for your entertainment and we are not here to diagnose, treat or provide any form of medical advice. We support your work with your licensed medical professionals and thank you for listening with respect to the ancient wisdom passed on by our lineage. We are going to break this episode down into two parts because we had a lot of conversation around the topic. In this episode you will get a sense of how Michelle, as a master healer and curandera, views trauma and her role in assisting with the healing of trauma. On the next episode we will hear some stories and traditions from ancient cultures and how they handled and healed from major life traumas. Listen in as Michelle and I chat about the topic. I started by asking her if trauma and PTSD are things that people do come to her to get help with.

Speaker 2:

All the time. People very often go through amazingly difficult and heinous situations. We do have to have methods and tools to help one another, ways to heal and ways to navigate. I have a background, a degree in psychology, and practiced in counseling, and I let that go years ago. I let my licensure go and I recognize that as I was working with people in conventional therapy. Let me say this before I make this comment I think conventional therapy has its purpose and has its way and has things that are very insightful and very helpful for people going through different things.

Speaker 2:

When I speak about this, I'm not dismissing that, I'm adding to it and saying that there's more. And so, in that I have that background, I have that knowledge of working with, let's say, we're talking about PTSD, trauma abuse. I have that background professionally, educationally, but I use only and mostly the ancient ways and the ancient methods because I find them to be very effective, very impactful for people to retrain the mind outside of the trauma and to retrain the energy frequencies outside of the hardship of a trauma and in the pain of a trauma and in the despair or the brokenheartedness or those things that we go through in a trauma. We don't want to stay stuck there, but we need to have the method to get out of that trauma, and so that is I think that's very important for people to understand you can, there is hope and you can literally transform that and come out of it.

Speaker 1:

So when people are living through traumatic events, so the event is not complete. Maybe they have PTSD and they're still going through something that's triggering and challenging. What's important for someone who is going through hell and having to function in daily society? What would you want for them to know first?

Speaker 2:

I think one of the very most important things is to develop a capacity to have a dual consciousness. So you're navigating through a situation, a circumstance. Let's say you're in an abusive marriage and you just got married a year ago or two years ago, and you're trying to find yourself out of that marriage, out of that situation, but you're getting your ass kicked or things are happening emotionally. Maybe no one's laying a hand on you, but there's a lot of narcissistic gaslighting types of mental fucks I'm going to use that word coming on to you. Well, you have to develop in yourselves, you have to develop that dual consciousness. So you're dealing with the issues at hand that you're walking through, you're dealing with those day to day and you're also, at the same time, remembering your strengths, remembering your gifts, remembering yourself as a healthy individual outside of that relationship, outside of that situation. So let's say I'm a scientist and I have this phenomenal job and I do cancer research and I do all of these things and I have all of these gifts, but I'm swallowed in the abuse of my wife or my husband and just in a very toxic environment and I haven't made the decision, let's say, to get out of the marriage because of whatever reasons, you have to hold on to your health and well-being. I think that is the first step, is recognizing I have two levels of consciousness. I'm dealing with a storm, I'm in the war, I'm in the battle and I'm also a full person with great capacities, great gifts, and I need to tap into those gifts. So when you do that, when you're doing that, it's a mental flex. It's like doing sit-ups if you want a flat stomach or you want abs, you have to build on it, you have to work it. It's a mental flex that you have to really come into the strength of that. And I would say that's true, to have that dual consciousness. That's true Whenever you're doing any kind of healing from anything or you're walking through a battlefield, as you said, you're walking through hell. You're in the dark night of the soul and you're like whoa, what the hell am I going to do? How am I going to get out of this? How am I going to transform with this, from this and with it? Because you're in it and so you do.

Speaker 2:

The mental part is the first part and we were taught as curanderos and I say we because I think about all of my maestros, maestras, my ancestors who carried this wisdom. We were always taught that you have to hold your greatest capacities and your greatest gifts always with you, in your sight and in your vision. You have to do that and you have to be strong, you have to turn into your strength. Remember this too is when you're in a battle, you're a very strong person, you're not a weak person. It takes a very strong person, you're not a weak person. It takes a very strong person to navigate through the battlefield of any situation, any traumatic situation, systemically traumatic, or in a family or in a relationship, in a friendship, all kinds of things. It takes a hell of a lot of strength to be in the trenches of hell. So you can turn that strength also outside of that and bring that different focus into awareness and carry that dual consciousness as you're walking.

Speaker 1:

One thing that I've personally encountered is that it's very challenging to talk to people who aren't aware that this is a big flex. Right, there's something to be said about having an awareness of the reality of being in a war, and it can't be glossed over. We don't want to dip into that toxic positivity. Can you talk about that when you are in the midst of it and trying to find a support system? But there are a lot of people that don't understand. Then what does a person? We're community people, so then what do we do?

Speaker 2:

That is a very negative thing to do. I believe that you have to be authentic in your circumstances and in your situation, because when you're positive and it's not authentic, you're not there yet. You're not in that positivity and you're dealing. You're in grief because you just got your ass kicked or you're in grief because, whatever the situation is, you have to acknowledge the grief. You have to acknowledge it. That's where I think talking to your friends or talking to your family or talking to a professional is very important Getting that guidance while you're navigating it. The trick is you don't want to get stuck there. You don't want to get stuck in the trauma, because when you think of PTSD, it's training the neurons to be in the flow of that trauma. You don't want to stay there long. And I think that's where the dual consciousness comes in, saying I need to remember. I need to remember that I'm productive. I need to remember that I'm healthy. I need to remember that I'm lovable. I need to remember the love that I have, the love that is given to me. I need to remember that I'm capable. I need to remember, whatever it is, that you are and you bring those alive side by side. If you are in the positivity. That's toxic and it's fake. It's not true and it's not real. You're suppressing those energies and you're going to wind up getting sick. You're going to wind up getting cancer, or you're going to have a heart attack, or you're going to your body's going to shift into other autoimmune things or something like that. You can't suppress things or something like that you can't suppress. And so having a dual consciousness is in no means suppressing or oppressing what you're experiencing or what is happening to you.

Speaker 2:

The other thing is oftentimes family members close family members. For me, I'm fortunate that I have a very strong circle. I've worked very hard to cultivate that circle with my family, so I have a very strong support in that circle. But oftentimes people are very dismissive of your trauma. They're very dismissive and family members are very dismissive and very judgmental. Sometimes a lot of people have that experience and they're like wait a minute, I just got raped. I just got raped, please don't act like nothing happened. They themselves don't know how to deal with it. They're shut off from their own traumas and their own emotions and so on and so forth.

Speaker 2:

And so we do have to turn where we are comprehended, and that's something different than being listened to. That's something different than just being heard and listening. Oh, I can listen to you. No, it's comprehension. Yes, it's really for a person to come, for you, to connect with somebody who comprehends what you're experiencing.

Speaker 2:

And that is also a piece of the healing, because when somebody can comprehend oh I just I was raped, or my husband cheated on me, or my wife just robbed me of all my money or whatever it is that causes the trauma or whatever it is that causes the trauma when you're in those circumstances, somebody has to comprehend you.

Speaker 2:

Because when they comprehend what you're feeling, what you're experiencing, then the healing can happen, because you have been held and heard and contained in that pain. It's a beautiful thing to have that. The other piece is that when the time comes, when the person is ready to say I'm ready to let it go, I'm ready to transform, I'm ready to remove the energetic charge, there are methods, there are ways in curanderismo and medicine, ways and cultural ways of our indigenous peoples in which ceremony, community, unity, love and our medicine tools heal. They heal people, they release that charge. It doesn't mean that the memory is gone, but you are no longer impacted by it in the same way. You're not in the PTSD, you've stepped out of that pattern of the trauma, of the shock, and that's a beautiful thing because we do have the capacity to heal. And it's not being positive, that's toxic, it's true healing.

Speaker 1:

Can you talk a little bit more about the importance of being understood? Can you say more about that?

Speaker 2:

Sure, I think when we are communicating with someone, 90% of the time we're communicating already ahead of the person. We want to talk, we want to be seen, we want to be heard, we want to be known. Our words are what is so important. Our thoughts, our opinion is so important, and we have to suspend that. So we have to become active listeners and we also have to learn to listen from our hearts. It's a totally different way to comprehend a person when we're listening from the intellect of the heart. That's a different place than being in the mind. When you're in the mind, it's this is the way you do it, this is the ingredients, this is what you got to do. If you do this, it's okay. Once you have PTSD, you're stuck in it forever, whatever it is. Oh, that's ridiculous. You shouldn't feel that way. No, you suspend you and you listen from the heart and you comprehend, you feel. Comprehension is feeling, it's an empathic way of understanding. When you suspend yourself and you are listening to another person from that place of being empathic, from your heart, from your love, that person is going to feel that soothing balm of that energy of love from the heart that's going to heal. Love heals everything and that's not a cliche, that's a truth, that frequency transforms everything. But the person on the end of the trauma needs to feel that what we want and what we need changes is to be loved, is to be cradled in that love so that we can receive that frequency and give that frequency to people who are in need. And it is also an art and it's something very ancient. Right now I'm thinking about talking circles when I've been to medicine meetings. Now when I say that medicine meetings, I don't do peyote, ayahuasca, any kind of drugs, hallucinogens, whatever. I've had a couple of experiences in my past which one day we'll talk about on one of our episodes meetings in which I was allowed to be in the meetings with the indigenous peoples in their tribal experiences, and it's phenomenal, when they have the talking, they have what they call the talking stick, and so a person is given the talking stick in the circle in the teepee, is given the talking stick in the circle in the teepee and they're given the talking stick and everybody has to actively listen. You can't be daydreaming. There's no telephones, you can't be thinking about paying your bills, whatever it is. You've got to be present with that person and what they're coming forth with in their need for healing and everybody gets the voice. But you have to wait your turn and you have to listen and you have to feel and you have to comprehend from that place of love. And it's a lesson. It's a lesson, it's a lesson. It's a lesson, it's a teaching. It's a beautiful thing to speak and be heard and be comprehended and not interrupted.

Speaker 2:

One of the pueblos and I asked one of the medicine people there. I said to this man, I said tell me, teach me what it is in your tribe that needs to happen when I go into these tribal council meetings or into these meetings with the elders, what needs to happen. And I'll tell you. The very first thing that medicine person said to me is you need to listen and they need to talk. Whoever is speaking can talk three, four hours. You don't interrupt, you listen and those meetings can go all night long and you listen.

Speaker 2:

And so think about that in terms of our Western way. Think about how contaminated we're becoming on social media. Somebody posts their opinion and it's their opinion, it's their Facebook wall. They can say whatever the heck they want. You don't need to engage it, you don't need to put them in their place, it's just listen to them. Okay, that's fine, I don't agree with you, or I do agree with you Great. But you don't have to be at war with that. The listening and the comprehension is so critical for our healing. So when a person comes to a curandera or medicine person, we are in our heart and we are in spiritual vision, we're ready to receive and that is healing For people that are empaths and that are holding the space and listening.

Speaker 1:

It seems to me there's a tiredness and exhaustion that comes from that Question one is that true? And question two if so, how is it replenished?

Speaker 2:

It can be true. I think the more experience you have with working with people who are in pain, wounded, in trauma, in illness, in dis-ease, disharmony, imbalances, you learn to hold the space and not fully absorb it, but completely feel it, and so there's skill in learning that. Now there are times in which a healer becomes exhausted, just like a friend or family member can be listening to somebody and just become totally drained and exhausted from what they just heard or what they just experienced by holding that energy for the person really comprehending it is not a judgment. It is just a part of a process of energetic exchange, and you need to know that you have to cleanse yourself afterwards. You have to release, you have to cleanse yourself, you have to restore yourself. What does that look like? I always come back to my ancient methods and saying you turn to the elements, you turn to water, you drink water, you flush it out of you, you bathe, you shower, you come outside to the air and let the air blow all of it and you consciously get it off of you or out of you. You can use the fire to burn it. To burn it and burn it off of your field, burn it out of the space in which you were discussing. You can also write it down, write things down and put it into the fire or speak it into the fire or speak it into the water, and these are also things that we have, what we call our limpias, our cleanses.

Speaker 2:

You can use an egg and running the egg over the body and the egg. What the egg does is very interesting it pulls energy out. So you can intentionally put that energy into the egg and get rid of the egg. Toss the egg. Some curanderos like to read the egg. I think I've said this before. I don't like to do that myself, but a lot of people read it and see what was in the energy field To learn a little bit more about the situation.

Speaker 2:

You can use flowers or herbs. You can use rosemary and sage that is fresh sage and whack yourself with it on your body, all over your body, and cleanse the body. You're shaking the energy field. You can use sound to cleanse the energy field. You can use high vibrational frequencies, classical music, beautiful music, sound bowls, drumming. Sound cleanses and restores the energy body, and not only does it restore, not only do these things restore oneself when you're the empath receiving or the healer receiving, but they also restore and help regenerate those frequencies for the person who's gone through the trauma. So that's a part of our tool bag that doesn't cost a cent that we can always have with us and use to assist ourselves to heighten our frequency, to get out of that lower vibrational frequency of the trauma, of the pain or whatever you've absorbed.

Speaker 1:

That's all for this week's episode of the pain or whatever you've absorbed. That's all for this week's episode. Join us next week as Michelle goes even deeper into the ways that ancient cultures handled trauma. In the meantime, if you're practicing any of the cleansing rituals you hear us discussing, please tag us at Kudandera Podcast on Instagram and we might feature you on our page. Remember to follow us on Instagram right now to get updates on our latest offerings, teachings and outreach. We are offering a donation-based seminar that's about to be launched, so follow Kudandera Podcast to stay informed and reserve your seat. Trust me, you don't want to miss this. Until next week. Blessings to you.